McNiff, S. “An Interview With Raphael Koenig and Benny Shaffer: Expanding Normality at the Edges of the Art World in China and Japan”. Creative Arts in Education and Therapy (CAET), Aug. 2019, pp. Pages 14 -24, https://caet.inspirees.com/caetojsjournals/index.php/caet/article/view/170.